laughing_tree: (Seaworth)
[personal profile] laughing_tree posting in [community profile] scans_daily


It’s a story about how mutants live. Not just as people, but as a People. It’s mischievous and sarcastic and a looong way from being holy. It’s a book about ethics and culture and growing fungus out of your own brain. It’s a book about rituals and thrills, sexy times and casual death. Above all it’s about Shared Ideas, in all their terrible beauty, and what they can do to the minds, hearts, and souls of the communities adrift on their tides. -- Si Spurrier

















Later:





Date: 2022-10-14 03:47 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] giraffesforever
Xavier's diary entry got me thinking about the Muir Island Saga. I remember a poignant couple pages at the end of Charles trying to find and bring back his son's mind. Made me a little sad for the way Charles's current stance is a pretty simple "We'd be better off if my son were dead / isolated".

Charles's current stance toward his son then reminded me of Moira and Proteus back when he was Mutant X. Which finally led me to an interesting thought, about how the once-saintly parents of mutantdom, Charles and Moira, have trended in one direction while the previously villainous children, David and Kevin, have gone the opposite way. A decades long changing of the guard.

Date: 2022-10-14 01:23 pm (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
The Moira thing doesn't work when it was retconned that she was always evil.

Date: 2022-10-14 02:18 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
She wasn't always evil. Her first life, I'm sure she was a real peach.

Date: 2022-10-14 03:24 pm (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
Evil as long as we've known her, anyways.

Date: 2022-10-14 02:27 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] giraffesforever
A fair point - maybe this Proteus (and for that matter, this Legion) turned out more inclined toward heroism specifically because of a much less benevolent parent? Like, children must rebel against their parents, and when your parents are defined as good then villainy is all that's left, but now that the parents are beyond merely flawed there's room for the kids to do better?

Date: 2022-10-17 01:16 am (UTC)
alliterator: (Default)
From: [personal profile] alliterator
She wasn't always evil. Heck, wasn't wasn't even truly evil when they kicked her out of Krakoa. She just felt like curing the mutants was the only solution. She thought she was saving them.

When she uploaded her mind into a robot body during a mental breakdown? That's when she became evil.

Date: 2022-10-17 01:43 am (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
She was evil as long as we knew her. And truly believing your good doesn't make you not evil.

Date: 2022-10-17 02:05 am (UTC)
alliterator: (Default)
From: [personal profile] alliterator
Gonna have to disagree. I think calling her "evil" is reductive and doesn't tell the actual story of what happened to her and what she wanted to do.

Date: 2022-10-17 02:14 am (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
Back in the 1800s, people genuinely believed that slaves would only run away because of mental illness and they had to be recaptured and brought back because they could never survive free.

Does that make them any less evil?

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Date: 2022-10-14 10:06 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] super_fly
So uh, what would Neil Gaiman have written as an inhabitant of the Marvel universe?

Date: 2022-10-14 06:41 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] donnblake
A biography of Duran-Duran?

Date: 2022-10-15 12:55 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Well, there was the Marvel press reease which described "Sleepwalker" as "Sandman, the Marvel Way"

(Apparently the legend about Marvel's Ediotr in Chief Tom DeFalco saying that Sleepwalker was "Sandman, done right" is untrue)

Date: 2022-10-14 12:07 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
Hold up...Moira didn't even kill Banshee first? She just started pulling a Katherine Knight on him while he was alive? Why do writers hate Banshee?!

Is this why David lost to Uranos? Because he "pissed away an endless supply of powers into the abyss" and let these personalities get erased?

Date: 2022-10-14 01:21 pm (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
Hell, why do they hate Moira so much?

Date: 2022-10-14 01:58 pm (UTC)
nyadnar17: The Green Sign (Default)
From: [personal profile] nyadnar17
I hope we get an answer to this one day.

It feels so meanspirited and completely out of leftfield.

Date: 2022-10-14 02:16 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
Maybe they have an issue with the Scots and the Irish?

Date: 2022-10-14 02:35 pm (UTC)
redmagpie: (Default)
From: [personal profile] redmagpie
I mean I'm Scottish and I'm fully behind Moira being evil now. Stealing Banshee's face is the funniest thing she's ever done and she should do it more.

Like genuinely I'm a lot more into Moira being this complex (as in self hatred is always complicated not as in she's morally grey) terrible person than I was into her previously.

More! Scottish! Villains! etc

Date: 2022-10-14 02:55 pm (UTC)
cainofdreaming: b/w (Default)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Wait, don't... Great. You've summoned Reverend Craig back into existence.

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Date: 2022-10-14 03:25 pm (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
What complexity? She's completely one-dimensional. And I see zero signs of self-hatred, it's everyone else she hates. If you're talking about the her being a mutant thing, that no longer applies now that she's a robot.

And the skinning thing wasn't played for comedy at all, meaning that your defense of it just makes it a failed attempt at drama.
Edited Date: 2022-10-14 03:37 pm (UTC)

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Date: 2022-10-14 03:26 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
Not his face. His entire skin.

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Date: 2022-10-14 02:46 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] giraffesforever
I'm imagining the ghost of Oliver Cromwell haunting the x-office, adding into the scripts terrible things for all the Irish and Scottish characters. It's not like Black Tom or Siryn have had easy times lately either.

Date: 2022-10-15 04:53 pm (UTC)
deh_tommy: (Default)
From: [personal profile] deh_tommy
I love that mental image and I thank you for making me picture it.

Date: 2022-10-17 01:18 am (UTC)
alliterator: (Default)
From: [personal profile] alliterator
I mean, they brought her back from the dead. If they hated her, they would have left her dead. Or killed her off again.

I think you are confusing "hating a character" with "finding a new purpose for an old character."

Date: 2022-10-17 01:43 am (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
That's not "finding a new purpose for an old character", that's replacing an old character with a new one and saying the old one was a lie all along.

Date: 2022-10-17 02:07 am (UTC)
alliterator: (Default)
From: [personal profile] alliterator
That's called a retcon. It's been done a million times in comics. So now Moira is just like Bucky Barnes.

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