Date: 2016-09-02 12:00 am (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
It's been said before, it'll be said again... subtle this is NOT.

I'm going to ask that the trigger warning: racism tag to be added to this post because, good grief!

Date: 2016-09-02 05:03 am (UTC)
raspberryrain: (raised eyebrow)
From: [personal profile] raspberryrain
Why should it be subtle?

Date: 2016-09-04 10:11 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
There's "subtle", there's "not subtle but valid" and then there's "In a story about the plight of Native American culture we have a cover where the blond white guy wearing a war bonnet is trying to shoot another hero who is tied to a totem pole"

Date: 2016-09-02 12:16 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
I suppose with that kind of cover, one should know what they're getting in for... but still...

The writer(s?) is really going out of their way to make Hal look like a braindead tool.
Not that Ollie comes across as much better.
Your idea was... well-intentioned, but your approach was waaaaaaaaay off, buddy.
Also, pretty sure whatever attempt Ollie has is kind of blown away the minute he starts ranting at Hal like, half a minute later.

... plus, where the hell'd he get that entirely yellow body-covering outfit anyway? If he had it, where's he keeping it? Is that why he's not there when the fight starts, because he's busy getting changed?

Date: 2016-09-03 03:39 am (UTC)
halloweenjack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] halloweenjack
I'm also wondering why Hal hasn't yet come up with the obvious solution of "if I'm up against something that's all-yellow, use the power ring to pick up something that's not yellow to hit the yellow thing with." Like, say, a log.

Date: 2016-09-04 10:13 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
It's always tricky because the ring tends to envelope things in it's energy field to levitate them, which would crumble as soon as it hit the yellow object. Hal could probably pick it up with a less enveloping field, but I always imagined it took more concentration to do so.

Date: 2016-09-05 12:53 am (UTC)
halloweenjack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] halloweenjack
Well, someone who's in charge of patrolling 1/3600th of the universe should be able to manage that, I'd hope.

Date: 2016-09-08 12:59 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fredneil.livejournal.com
He could lift a log a good distance over someone's head, then remove the field. Dropping anvils on people seems appropriate for O'Neil's run.

Date: 2016-09-02 12:43 am (UTC)
sarahnewlin: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sarahnewlin
Hal getting hit by the log looks like his neck is snapping

Date: 2016-09-02 06:59 am (UTC)
lyricalswagger: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lyricalswagger
I kind of love that panel.

Date: 2016-09-02 04:53 am (UTC)
cypherfdp: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cypherfdp
I've been rolling my eyes so hard at Ollie over the past couple of issues it's close to changing the earth's rotation

Date: 2016-09-02 05:32 am (UTC)
zapbiffpow: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zapbiffpow
Y'know, this Injustice 2 gear system is getting way out of hand.

Date: 2016-09-02 05:54 am (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Oh crud. Hal's habit of getting knocked out from blows to the head has gone contagious. Of all possible pandemics in the world this was the one I least expected.

Date: 2016-09-02 10:38 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] agharta75
Uh, "redskin brothers"?

You didn't quite get it, did you, DC?

Date: 2016-09-02 10:47 am (UTC)
alicemacher: Lisa Winklemeyer from the webcomic Penny and Aggie, c2004-2011 G. Lagacé, T Campbell (Default)
From: [personal profile] alicemacher
I am boggled at how the story portrays Native American activists as perfectly okay with Ollie appropriating their traditional dress and acting as their "symbol" because he thought they weren't showing enough "starch" in their struggle against Pudd and O'Rourke. It's not up to him to make strategic decisions on their behalf, nor to act as though he himself were a member of their nation.

Date: 2016-09-02 12:19 pm (UTC)
wizardru: Hellboy (Default)
From: [personal profile] wizardru
Yeah, this is really careening into the 'you tried, Shang' territory. I mean, the intentions are good, but the execution is far more painful and on the nose than I remembered.

Also, I really begin to feel sorry for Hal, here (and that's saying something). Every issue seems to be the same formula of Hal staying with the Man, while Ollie hangs with the oppressed and takes up their cause (though it seems more like he's appropriating it, instead) and is apparently always right.

I get that there are elements here which were pushing boundaries and that they were trying to do some noble stuff here...but Good Grief.

Date: 2016-09-02 01:24 pm (UTC)
the_blue_padre: (Default)
From: [personal profile] the_blue_padre
Yes, awkward to the point of being massively offensive, but it's easy to mock previous generations for being so foolishly backward. I want to always remember that the comics of this era were still being written for and marketed to young people...kids...and the kids of that era, my generation, weren't as exposed to multiculturalism as we are today.

Critique is necessary and appropriate, I just don't want us to forget the context. My rare two cents' worth.

Date: 2016-09-02 02:21 pm (UTC)
bradygirl_12: (irish ying-yang)
From: [personal profile] bradygirl_12
Critique is necessary and appropriate, I just don't want us to forget the context. My rare two cents' worth.

Exactly! People always forget to take into account the mores of the era in which they're reading a past comic.

Date: 2016-09-02 07:29 pm (UTC)
zapbiffpow: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zapbiffpow
Nah, man, you can appreciate the era this comic book was published and still be able to provide criticism for these scans, independent of that appreciation.

Just because my comment doesn't explicitly say "I am aware this was from a past era, and shall now list the good things about it to assuage its proponents" in some form of smaller-font, rapid-speak disclaimer, doesn't mean I automatically forget what era this was from, nor the fact that it is a product of its time. It's not like there's an amnesia switch or something, the same way it's not a switch that toggles between 'Necessary and appropriate critique' and 'Remember and appreciate historical context'.

Date: 2016-09-02 09:52 pm (UTC)
thehood: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehood
That doesn't really excuse it.

Date: 2016-09-03 03:43 am (UTC)
halloweenjack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] halloweenjack
*sigh* Yes, Denny O'Neil probably had the best of intentions, and is at least trying to be relevant and not just have them go up against Sinestro or something. But he could have done at least a little bit of research and not had Ollie wear a Plains headdress in the Pacific Northwest. (Unless the point was that Ollie was being a tool, in which case, yeah, that works.)

Date: 2016-09-08 01:05 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fredneil.livejournal.com
Getting that right was probably more Adams' job. It does fit into the character, that he wouldn't have bothered learning the details, but I'd guess it's more likely that Adams just didn't do the research. This being long before the internet, he'd have had to spend a lot of time on something that would only be used for a few panels and wouldn't be noticed by the majority of his audience, and he had deadlines, so I'm guessing accuracy wasn't a priority.

Date: 2016-09-05 07:18 am (UTC)
thedocyoshi: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thedocyoshi
I remember laughing when I read this issue. I take it that was NOT the intended reaction?

Good grief every time Oliver went on one of his rants I was always like "Dude the evil scientists and giant robots are trying to kill people!"

Why do I like Green Arrow again? Oh right the cartoons. Where he's actually a decent person. *thinks about the time he ziplined while singing his theme song*

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