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Beast boy has had an unfortunately ill luck misfortune in the last two years. First he almost died and lost an eye to Deathstroke. Then lost his entire essence entity, because of Doctor Hate. Please DC. Have mercy and no more misery for Gar.

Also Amanda Waller took over the Hall of Justice and now going to use it for her new headquarters. She partly won, in her goal of getting people to doubt and mistrust
superheroes.

Date: 2024-01-31 12:15 am (UTC)
coldfury: (Default)
From: [personal profile] coldfury
I'm not sure where they're going with the Waller stuff, but I'm afraid they've overplayed their hand.

I feel like we're headed to a Civil War scenario, but just like both of Marvel's Civil War events it doesn't work well when one side is too cartoonishly evil. If any Justice League level heroes side with Waller despite her actions it's going to harm their character pretty badly.

Peacemaker is fine because he doesn't lose anything by being loyal to Waller or the government. There's plenty of characters who could grow and get exposure from being attached to her side. I'm worried from the solicits that Roy and/or Ollie might join up, and that would be a mistake in my opinion.

Date: 2024-01-31 03:44 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] tcampbell1000
OLLIE?

Oh, sure, that'd make ALL the sense! If there's one thing we know about Oliver Queen, it's that he LOVES conservative politicians telling people what to do!

(Which is not to say DC wouldn't try it. There's a real, um, range of quality in the scripting of their "events" in the last five years or so.)

Date: 2024-01-31 04:49 am (UTC)
coldfury: (Default)
From: [personal profile] coldfury
It's one of those things that makes sense if you squint and ignore the bits of the character you don't want to think about. Like, Ollie is often portrayed as the everyman, normal guy hero. That was the whole take on him in JLU. So from that sense, if you're trying to present Waller as trying to 'take back power for humanity' I can see that angle working, if she was on a more defensible, neutral position.

Maybe the solicit cover is a dupe, maybe Oliver is getting hoodwinked or is hoodwinking Waller, but I can't help but worry that we're heading into a Civil War II where they're trying to staff up 'both sides' and one side is already morally bankrupt from the starting line.

Date: 2024-02-01 03:45 am (UTC)
zachbeacon: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zachbeacon
Yeah, this is a team-up that only makes sense if they're both being tortured eternally by Neron or something.

Date: 2024-01-31 12:39 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] dan_ingram
So Waller's plan was to kill a million people, the heroes saved them, easily, and for some reason people trust her more?

MU citizens look brilliant by comparison.

Feels like she's been replaced with her Arrow-verse counterpart, who was willing to nuke a city to kill a dozen guys on super steroids.

Date: 2024-01-31 03:59 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] tcampbell1000
In fairness to this story, it does sell Waller as an adroit politician. Nobody knows she planned to kill people, and the Titans can't go public with that without looking like conspiracy theorists at best and attacking their own critics at worst. And the heroes didn't save the people that easily; there were days of people turning into beasts and lots of general chaos that all looked like the side effect of the heroes fumbling an operation. A megadeath would've worked out better for Waller in that regard, but she'll work with what she's got.

Waller's still pretty flat as a character these days, but her only really dumb-looking decision in this arc is her eagerness to work with an unknown agent named "Doctor Hate."

Date: 2024-01-31 08:48 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] dan_ingram
I'm pretty sure she outright said that she intended to kill the remaining infected, and that Jon just barely saved a bunch. There's no reason why they can't hold their own press conference, really.

Date: 2024-01-31 02:22 am (UTC)
cainofdreaming: b/w (Default)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Believe in humanity. Be... friends of humanity.

Date: 2024-01-31 02:54 am (UTC)
lbd_nytetrayn: Star Force Dragonzord Power! (Default)
From: [personal profile] lbd_nytetrayn
I don't know why, but something about the timing of this just feels... I don't know.

Like I don't want my escapism to be into a world where they look down upon the heroes?

Date: 2024-01-31 03:21 am (UTC)
akodo_rokku: (Default)
From: [personal profile] akodo_rokku
It's the same shit DC has been doing for almost 50 years now: chasing being as "cool" as Marvel and failing, because if you TRY to be cool you cannot possibly be cool.

Date: 2024-01-31 02:29 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] badtakegoesbrrr
Agreed. I'm disappointed that the Titans didn't get at least a solid year of supervillain-of-the-week adventures where they got to have fun while acting like a family. It's disappointing how DC can only let the Titans to exist as a lesson on how the Justice League will always be better because...something something made-up bullshit money something.

Date: 2024-01-31 07:54 am (UTC)
onsokumaru: (Default)
From: [personal profile] onsokumaru
Glad that Gar's death didn't stick.
Sometimes even Titans are allowed to live (ok, it's easier when you are called Beast Boy and not Risk or Pantha)

Date: 2024-01-31 08:04 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
I could tell it wouldn't from the start. All those pieces of him everywhere? Though I did think they would need to involve The Red to get his mind back.

Date: 2024-02-04 08:13 pm (UTC)
windleopard2: (Default)
From: [personal profile] windleopard2
Gar's death was never going to stick. It's Chunk's death that bugs me. Wally doesn't even acknowledge it and if Lian is any indication, we'll have to wait 11 years or more for him to come back.

Date: 2024-01-31 12:16 pm (UTC)
huntleyhaverstock: Joel McCrea as Johnny Jones, aka "Huntley Haverstock," in Alfred Hitchcock's FOREIGN CORRESPONDENT (Default)
From: [personal profile] huntleyhaverstock
Yeah, I'm noticing a lot of really interesting and compelling anti-fascist content in Marvel's books over the past decade or so -- from Al Ewing's entire run on U.S. AVENGERS to J. Michael Straczynski bringing the real-life history of the German-American Bund into CAPTAIN AMERICA. All of the Marvel stuff I've seen in that vein feels a lot more earnest and compelling than this, which hits squarely on the nose.

(Still, if it gets more people to realize that "order" is synonymous with "you do what I want, and I do what I want," I guess it can't hurt?)

Date: 2024-01-31 01:35 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
I can't believe that not ONE of them thought to bring a camera or something during the confrontation with Waller. Maybe find some EVIDENCE? Christ sake, did Nightwing forget how to be a detective?

Date: 2024-01-31 02:25 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] badtakegoesbrrr
So Waller is going full-Fascist. Okay, saw that coming. Wow, you renamed the Hall of Justice the Hall of Order. How subtle. It's infuriating, but at least it serves a narrative point.

But my problem with all this is, AMANDA WALLER IS CORRECT ABOUT THE TITANS. The Titans trusted Raven, and her evil side got out (somehow). Now they're trusting her again, right after they just learned her evil half was working with Waller, and that she was responsible for turning Beast Boy into Garro. They're assuming that Raven has her evil side contained back in her gem, despite not seeing it happen, and despite the obvious problem that the gem seemingly did nothing the last time. No immediate questioning. No quarantine. No nothing. Hell, with Dick being Bruce's kid you'd think he'd have already kicked off some plan to put Raven in a coma or something. But no, let's blindly trust the person who has not only BETRAYED THE TITANS BEFORE ON ACCOUNT OF BEING POSSESSED, but is also almost singularly responsible for tanking their public image.

DC is telling us that the mass-murdering Fascist is correct, at least about the Titans if nothing else. And the Titans are our heroes. Do you see how that's a bad look?

Date: 2024-01-31 04:10 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
Pretty sure Waller was the one who released Raven's evil side in the first place.

Date: 2024-01-31 04:32 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] badtakegoesbrrr
Maybe? I haven't seen any conclusive evidence of that yet. How she did it boggles my mind, but I'm sure DC can come up with something. But none of that changes my second point: they're continuing to trust Raven (so far) without question. That's stupid. The Titans need to not be stupid. Keeping Raven around unchecked just bolsters Waller's point that the Titans can't be trusted.

Date: 2024-01-31 05:01 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
She's one of their nearest and dearest friends.

Date: 2024-01-31 05:24 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] badtakegoesbrrr
Yes, and she's tried to kill them a few times. I'm not saying they should blow her head off and burn the body, but maybe gently asking her to leave for the sake of accountability wouldn't be out of line. They can give her a nice place to stay, check in on her frequently, etc. But the Titans can't go around acting like...well, teenagers. They're the new Justice League. When one of them gets possessed and does an oopsie, they need to act like adults and find ways to keep from making the problem worse. They can be friends to Raven while accepting that having her around on the team is maybe not such a good idea right now.

Date: 2024-01-31 08:01 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blues32
I'm pretty sure the Justice League has never done that with any of their members when they get mind controlled or something. Why would the Titans? Besides, the public has no idea about Raven's involvement. They're focused on Beast Boy. If there's any sort of public relation issue, it's with him.
Edited Date: 2024-01-31 08:03 pm (UTC)

Date: 2024-01-31 08:14 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] badtakegoesbrrr
This isn't even mind control, though. It's an issue of one of the Titans having an evil persona living inside of them. An evil persona who should have been contained yet got free somehow, which the Titans can't yet explain. And Beast Boy should also take a leave of absence while he gets physically checked out to make sure he's all good and the active Titans do damage control. Frankly I think they would be doing him a favor, what with his being a giant space-abomination, then dead, then a vegetable in that order.

Date: 2024-02-01 07:48 am (UTC)
mastermahan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mastermahan
Yep. The Titans know Raven has an evil twin. They know Raven and Evil Raven fought while no one was watching and only one returned. Do they do anything to verify they got the correct Raven back? They do not.

Juvpu vf abg terng, fvapr lrf, Enira qvq trg ercynprq ol ure rivy gjva. Gur Gvgna ernyyl nera'g gung erfcbafvoyr.

Date: 2024-02-01 03:38 am (UTC)
zachbeacon: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zachbeacon
You know, a lot has been made of Waller becoming more evil but I don't think we talk enough about how she's also getting dumber.

Her activities at Belle Reve or wherever have long been somewhat of an open secret but she wasn't holding press conferences to announce the location of a new Suicide Squad HQ.

"Assassination Coordinates"... as the insufferable tech billionaire likes to say.

(Also there's just something funny about any alleged "mastermind" going out of their way to antagonize Nightwing. The guy is capable of just about anything Batman is and he's as liked within the hero community as Superman and Alan Scott. I have problems with the current Nightwing run but watching the full force of the superhero community come out when Dick gets kidnapped was not one of them.)

Date: 2024-02-01 05:29 am (UTC)
windleopard2: (Default)
From: [personal profile] windleopard2
So when is Chunk coming back?

Or do we have to wait another 11 years like with Lian Harper?

Date: 2024-02-02 07:09 am (UTC)
justsotired: (Default)
From: [personal profile] justsotired
I feel like this story's been written a million times, better. I'd say Amanda Waller feels like a cartoon character but CCH Pounder's waller had WAY more nuance and pathos and - well - logic behind what she was doing than this.

Also, they just couldn't help themselves and tipped their hand about the Big Surprise, which I guess runs counter to what drives me barmy about the current X-Club leaving huge story holes and calling it a twist when they fill them, but this was the sort of thing where you let the audience stew about what's going on for awhile before you just come out and say yeah, that's what happened.

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